/liberty/ - Liberty

They'll say the same thing whether they are notice cause and effect or not. Whining about inequality is a tool to raise taxes and grab power, not to fix any sort of problems. Not that I mean to imply that inequality is any kind of genuine problem, of course.

It works that way in Nationstates, but one graph doesn’t suffice to prove works that way in real life. Instead of notice-bitching, learn to construct speculative causal constructs. Where but Nationstates would you even notice this? The defenders of the gold standard never mentioned egalitarianism when they were allowed for a time to pretend integrity mattered in governance. So if you did get this from Nationstates, notice, if you’re going to be obedient to one random simulator for your egalitarian policy guidance, you can still do better than nakedly asserting the correlation.

I have this one in the uncertainty bucket because I haven’t come up with a speculative causal construct for it.

>>103842

Without a concern for inequality how the blazes can someone be libertarian? Flat power distribution is the ultimate guarantor of rights. That’s a big part of why we support gun rights! Chunk egalitarianism out of libertarianism and you’ll eventually lose your guns.

>>103353

>then why has violence fallen dramatically over the last 300 years? has society becomes more societal?

I am very skeptical. The 20th century was one of the most violent in the history of mankind.

Other than that, yes, people have become more societal overall, we are taught how to get along with each other more than we used to, and in fact more than is good for us. Unironically, people these days are too complacent. Just a few weeks ago, I was told by a social worker that I have no right to self-defense, that is how complacent people are. The very idea that sometimes, violence might be a solution, is appalling to many.

>>103348

>There will be no police to enforce laws that protect you from niggers, commies, fascists, etc

The laws don't protect you, the police does (currently, more on that soon). South Africa, Honduras, Germany and Sweden have esentially the same legal protection against homicide, yet their homicide rates a very different. The reason is partially culture, partially that the police in Germany and Sweden actually does its job (kinda). There are many factors that influence crime rates, the law isn't one. To act like "the law" mysteriously protects you as soon as the police enforce it is to get things exactly backwards, it's the police that protects you by enforcing the laws, not the law protecting you by being enforced by the police. You got me? To say otherwise is essentially allegorical. There is nothing wrong with it 90% of the time, but this discussion is the rest of the 10%.

Now, after we've hopefully settled the semantics, let me point out that ancaps are big fans of personal armament precisely because it enables you to defend yourself from niggers and commies, and that we have always maintained that a private police works. There are several historical examples, from the railway police to some startup firm in America that was set up by cops who got sick of how inefficient the police force was. Throughout thePost too long. Click here to view the full text.

>>103378

You're assuming they'd have a monopoly on violence. If they start demanding too much, you can leave them and join another company. If you can't, then that still doesn't suggest they'll be untouchable. You *might* end up with a mafia, but that can be the case even now. Mexico has a mafia and it's not lacking in government, and the Chicago Police Department has acted like a mafia in the past (probably still does). The police department in my town of birth has bossed my family around more than any mafia in the area.

>>103362

Its track record when it comes to protecting my family is also abysmal. My family was once asked by the DA to take care of the store of a neighbor who was put in custody for selling drugs. So we did, but that meant selling much of his inventory. We talked about this with his lawyer, and he gave it his okay. We assumed the lawyer knew what he was talking about.

A rather short time later, our neighbor got out. He threatened us at least three times, and each time, the police took way too long to respond. First time, they didn't come at all when I called them, just laughed in my face and pretty much told me I deserved it for hanging out with drug dealers (at the request of the DA?). My mother had to call them, they arrived an hour after the guy was gone. Second time, two cops came, they seemed like two genuinely nice guys, but they couldn't do anything, apparently. Third time, my mother had to tell them the history we have with the neighbor including the deal we had with the DA, our family history, her blood group and the history of Constantinople in the 4th century before they would come.

Last time I called the cops was on a different matter. This time, they charged me for protecting myself, and their police reports were worthless. They didn't even know what the area looked like. It was clear they didn't want to work on the case, and yet they did.

So, the next time anyone gets in my face, I will not bother to call the cops. Post too long. Click here to view the full text.

>>103397

>My family was once asked by the DA to take care of the store of a neighbor

Why was your family obligated (or forced?) to manage your neighbor's business?

>>103423

We weren't obligated. We could've denied the request, but back then, we didn't think it was that much of a big deal, and we certainly didn't expect such a big shitstorm from developing out of it. Most importantly, we didn't think the DA would fuck us over so badly. You'd think if you responded to their request, they'd actually care a little bit about your wellbeing, but no. Nothing. There is very little loyalty in the public sector.

>>103348

kike tier double-post. reported

>>103622

/pol/ is variable, some are straight cappies

>>103710

You're right. classical liberals arent. Neolibs are just fiscally conservative social liberals

>>103803

I feel like most of the pro-market /pol/acks have moved away from the board and don't lurk or post there all that often. Purity spiraling has turned it into a NEETSoc circlejerk.

>>103804

>Neolibs are just fiscally conservative social liberals

Assuming you mean the old definition of neoliberal instead of the contemporary one (which may be defined as "blue neocon"), I wouldn't say that's really true. Neoliberals in the vein of Mises were more apathetic on social issues than they were socially left. They didn't virtue-signal for faggotry and didn't demand that people break freedom of association to accomadate it, they just didn't care enough to expend effort in opposing it. This attitude of apathy, however, created the environment that allowed the faggotphiliacs to gain influence.

>>103809

>Purity spiraling has turned it into a NEETSoc circlejerk.

Stupid question, but how could we possibly utilize this effect to turn something into an ancap circlejerk?

I'm not watching e-celebs, give it to me in your own words.

What exactly were you expecting?

bump

>>97455

is the belief natural rights an egalitarian belief?

>>97485

They lack free minded individualists.

>>103642

What should the average Western man do *when he's persuaded.

>>103642

I agree with you in some respects (politically active libertarians should use legislative and judicial means to achieve change in a relatively peaceful manner). On the subject of abortion, given a libertarian view of natural rights, it would be more consistent at least for the life of a baby to be afforded the same protection under the law as any other human being.

However, in terms of immigration/border defense, I think it would be unwise to try to correct the ill effects of government policy by adding more policy on top of it. We should strive to simplify and increase consistency rather than increase complexity, and this means we ought to attack the government policies which fuel the existence of an "immigration crisis" in the first place–the "immigration" part and the "crisis" part: Welfare programs creating malinvestment by giving immigrants false incentives to migrate to Western nations. Governments should not be subsidizing the flow of immigrants into a nation; if they come here, they ought to feed and clothe themselves with their own money and labor. Military intervention forcing many out of their home countries. The "War on Drugs" precluding the production and consumption of drugs by safe, legal means and ultimately leading to the rise of violent cartels. Minimum wage, "bottlenecker" licensure programs intended to minimize competition, and other restrictive regulations that place an artifically high price on local labor, causing many businesses to resort to either automation or illegal labor, or simply outsource.

I think doing activism in the legislature and judiciary helps but I think it acts like a stop gap. Agorism could complement it to build a long term free society while the legislature work buys breathing room for the agorists.

>>97078

>How about you prove the claim wrong

>>97043

I would stick it in her pooper if she was down, yes.

>>97086

It's been a week, I'm still waiting.

>>97363

You'll be waiting forever, faggot, because your claim makes no fucking sense.

>>97078

pope jp2 was used to priests being accused of pedophilia because he lived in communist poland and communists did not like catholicism and wanted to degrade priests by such accusations

so jp2 probably thought that these accusations were false just like accusations in communist poland

>>96980

Niggers don't understand the concept of "voting", and in the U.S., politicians have to cajole them to go to the polls like toddlers. A good chunk of niggers vote, but I doubt they understand the implications of casting one.

http://archive.is/9gt8t

>>96980

They have some of the worst turnout of any demographic (I think only spics are lower than they are), but you don't need very high turnout when you absolutely saturate a district or two with them. And as niggers drive down property values and encourage the productive members of society to move away, even if they're just a large plurality to start, the wonders of Section 8 housing means they become a majority before too long.

>>97022

what is section 8 housing?

>>103505

The leftists try to take credit for it, but it was mostly a result of the industrial revolution and factory lines. We Are Capitalists made a short (2-4 minute) labor day video on it a few years ago but it seems to have been removed from youtube. Here's the accompanying article if I remember correctly. https://fee.org/articles/thank-capitalism-for-the-weekend/

I have some other sources but I won't even get home for about 12 hours between work and the gym. I'll try to remember to post them tonight. Polite sage because shit thread.

>>103551

Interesting, you mention wages would that decrease somewhat. I know you said that it should be more hours cut then wages but I just wonder how much of the wages would be cut.

>>103461

so what does the government *actually* do to stop this?

'taking your money' is not an excuse, because without government services you would be paying for your own schools, security, pension, and paying more for everything subsidised

>>103629

The answer is still "taking my money." The top three federal expenditures, which make up a supermajority of the budget, are two different kinds of welfare and defense spending a third kind of welfare. It's safe to say I receive zero benefit from any of these things. I don't use the vast majority of the other services the state provides, either. Those few I do use frequently involve me waiting in lines for far longer than I like, filling out far more forms than are necessary; that is to say these services are undersupplied, overpriced, and of inferior quality. This isn't even getting into the amount of overhead costs involved in collecting taxes, which are decidedly higher than what a business spends on ensuring receivables. Per the Economic Calculation Problem, among other things, it can be shown that these services will be allocated efficiently by the private market, rather than being under or over supplied. By the same token, private supply is of these goods would be lower in price and higher in quality. All of this translates to an immense amount of productive that simply does not exist thanks to the public sector. Because this productivity has gone down the drain, we must work more hours per week to compensate.

Further, regardless of the quality or efficiency of government services, the coercive nature of taxation means that the very act of taxing necessarily kills productivity, regardless of how the money is used. Taxation is alwats a redistribution of wealth, from the taxpayer to the tax receiver. Even if no welfare system is in place, wealth is still redistributed from the taxpayers to the government and government contractors. This redistribution increases the payoff of being a tax receiver, and decreases the playoff of being a productive tax player. If there is less incentive to be productive, people will stop being productive and become tax receivers. This increases the total cost of the tax receivers and decreases the revenue from tax payers, meaning that the tax rate must be increased to pay for the tax receivers. The tax increase causes a further decreased incentive to be productive, which causes fewer people to be productive, which necessitates a further tax increase…

>>103390

Ah so that's where that copypasta came from.

>>103496

Also the aesthetic is completely shit, nothing looks as cool as it does in cyberpunk.

>>103496

Did you see the Gameplay demonstration? To me, it looked like it was full of the coll cyberpunk stuff, like a guy whose entire face from the upper jaw up was replaced with cybernetics. Looked breddy spuky.

>>103390

>transsexual transhumanist

I kek'd

>>103572

I'm talking about real life being a disappointing version of a cyberpunk dystopia. The game on other hand does look really good.

>>103166

are jewish usurers part of european banking? because they were part of europe from the begining

just see "the merchant of venice"

>>103518

>i know it has led to quasi ancap ideals

Explain.

>>103195

Ok LaRouche

Shariah law forbids charging interest, speculation, options, futures, derivatives, etc. Much like concurrent canon law and our modern-day democracies, the financial regulations were really just political promises to rally the peasants to their side against private power.

It seems to me that the only reason it forbids fractional reserves is because all transactions must have "material finality". This boils down to picking your poison. Do you want fraudulent banking, or do you want dysfunctional banking?

>>103520

To be fair, you don't really need to read a lot of books to be a libertarian. It's a simple enough ideology.

>>103520

I can find all of them besides choice. Who is the author?

>>103494

are you ego dyke?

>>103546

I know that's what he's saying. I'm disagreeing with him and saying the people that would count as lynchpins arent public figures so you wouldnt know who to go after anyway.

>>103549

Alright "Wiseman," even if there was such a cabal, I bet you it would be structured in such a way such that even if every one of them died, their successors would pick up and nothing would happen.

>>103455

>all Americans are /fbi/

Die.

>>103469

so judging by the clock, 2800s will be when shit really starts to fly. sigh…

>>103464

>Ted K

no. people are becoming more wary of big tech these days.

Buy crypto.

>>103558

Money might grow on trees but resources are limited.

>>103574

The government will simply own everything and manage the entire labor force after inflating all purchasing power away from people. And then the real fun can begin.

>>103561

PPT